Kent Wien
Well-Known Member
I’d love to see pics!
G3X Touch Retrofit?
- Thread starter jliltd
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- g3x touch glass panel retrofit
jliltd
Active Member
I really like the description of your old & new technology panel. Do you have the tall panel or the short panel?
I also really like the GI 275 system and features. It is very nice and does a lot. Perfect for the right application. And beautiful display.
In my opinion the G3X system really should still be paired with a G5 backup rather than a GI 275. For more than one reason. First, the G5 was designed around the G3X system and fully integrates with it. The biggest example is the fact that if the G3X looses it air data/attitude LRU (GSU 25) the G3X basically goes down. If you have a G5 on the CAN Bus and the G3X looses the GSU 25 then the G5 steps in and takes over and provides this data so the pilot sees no difference in the flight deck. The G3X keeps on trucking. Now if you change that scenario and have a GI 275 instead of a G5 the GI 275 cannot provide a backup ADHARS to the G3X. At that point the more expensive GI 275 is all you got to fly by. Point is that a flight sensor compromised G3X display can keep working with G5, but cannot with GI 275.
There are a few less significant reasons. Like setting the barometer reading across all G3X hardware with one knob. And then in the case of the GI 275 having to install a sonalert audio warning device in the cockpit if paired with a G3X. This sonalert hardware is not a required when paired with the G5.
The GI 275 has different DNA than the G3X/G5 and was designed to work with IFR navigators the G series TXi flight displays and legacy third-party auto pilots (for the "AP" part number upgrade). Rather than the CAN Bus architecture of the G3X/G5 the GI 275 uses Garmin HSDB (high-speed data bus) and ARINC architecture. The GI 275s do have a set of CAN Bus pins on one connector but it has not been designated for any use at this point. Also, the only RS 232 serial output format supported by the GI 275 is altitude (can use it as an encoder). The G5 has multiple options.
The GI 275 is a much bulkier unit and has a lot of great hardware built in. The depth of the GI 275 can cause installation issues for instrument panels with shallow depth or steel cross tubes. The G5 is a more simple device and depends on optional external LRUs to provide interface options and is very thin. So it's like the GI 275 has taken all those external interface units and built them right into the guts of the GI 275, whether you use them or not. This is also reflected in the depth. And in the price since it's a lot of hardware. That's also the reason that a 3-display GI 275 installed can cost as much or more than a G3X installed. I would discourage the EIS version of the GI 275 as it's a lot more expensive than the competition and Garmin is still ironing out issues with sensors and software. And frankly I can't see a lot of difference compared to the much cheaper Electronics International CGR 30P. Can you think of any reason to have engine information on a PFD or MFD? When the same information can be had for less and leave PFDs or MFDs free of screen-hungry EIS information.
In summary the GI 275 and G5 are similar in some ways but different in even more ways. My advice is to always pair a G3X flight deck with a G5. The GI 275 would be a better choice for stand-alone dual IFR installations or in conjunction with a G series TXi display. But sometimes you never know what features Garmin may add in a future GI 275 software update. Free advice and sometimes you gets what you pays for.
I also really like the GI 275 system and features. It is very nice and does a lot. Perfect for the right application. And beautiful display.
In my opinion the G3X system really should still be paired with a G5 backup rather than a GI 275. For more than one reason. First, the G5 was designed around the G3X system and fully integrates with it. The biggest example is the fact that if the G3X looses it air data/attitude LRU (GSU 25) the G3X basically goes down. If you have a G5 on the CAN Bus and the G3X looses the GSU 25 then the G5 steps in and takes over and provides this data so the pilot sees no difference in the flight deck. The G3X keeps on trucking. Now if you change that scenario and have a GI 275 instead of a G5 the GI 275 cannot provide a backup ADHARS to the G3X. At that point the more expensive GI 275 is all you got to fly by. Point is that a flight sensor compromised G3X display can keep working with G5, but cannot with GI 275.
There are a few less significant reasons. Like setting the barometer reading across all G3X hardware with one knob. And then in the case of the GI 275 having to install a sonalert audio warning device in the cockpit if paired with a G3X. This sonalert hardware is not a required when paired with the G5.
The GI 275 has different DNA than the G3X/G5 and was designed to work with IFR navigators the G series TXi flight displays and legacy third-party auto pilots (for the "AP" part number upgrade). Rather than the CAN Bus architecture of the G3X/G5 the GI 275 uses Garmin HSDB (high-speed data bus) and ARINC architecture. The GI 275s do have a set of CAN Bus pins on one connector but it has not been designated for any use at this point. Also, the only RS 232 serial output format supported by the GI 275 is altitude (can use it as an encoder). The G5 has multiple options.
The GI 275 is a much bulkier unit and has a lot of great hardware built in. The depth of the GI 275 can cause installation issues for instrument panels with shallow depth or steel cross tubes. The G5 is a more simple device and depends on optional external LRUs to provide interface options and is very thin. So it's like the GI 275 has taken all those external interface units and built them right into the guts of the GI 275, whether you use them or not. This is also reflected in the depth. And in the price since it's a lot of hardware. That's also the reason that a 3-display GI 275 installed can cost as much or more than a G3X installed. I would discourage the EIS version of the GI 275 as it's a lot more expensive than the competition and Garmin is still ironing out issues with sensors and software. And frankly I can't see a lot of difference compared to the much cheaper Electronics International CGR 30P. Can you think of any reason to have engine information on a PFD or MFD? When the same information can be had for less and leave PFDs or MFDs free of screen-hungry EIS information.
In summary the GI 275 and G5 are similar in some ways but different in even more ways. My advice is to always pair a G3X flight deck with a G5. The GI 275 would be a better choice for stand-alone dual IFR installations or in conjunction with a G series TXi display. But sometimes you never know what features Garmin may add in a future GI 275 software update. Free advice and sometimes you gets what you pays for.
belloypilot
Active Member
Excellent write-up. Thanks for that. I wanted to put a G3X in my short panel A1-B but getting it to fit would have driven costs higher than I wanted, so I settled for a dual G5. We did, however, put the G3X in our Grumman and the only comment I’d challenge is the value of having the Garmin EIS. I really like being able to upload complete engine and flight data to the Garmin site and review both together. That’s worth a premium for me, but I can understand that it might not be for others.
Cheers.
jliltd
Active Member
Agreed. It is nice to be able to upload engine data all at once with flight data. And even more so with G3X EIS as in your case. I have that with G3X in my RV-8 and use it. The G3X also is a different EIS module and is all shaken down. The GI 275 EIS is still having teething problems. So the EIS makes more sense with a big-screen G3X than the GI 275. By the way, with the CGR30P in my Husky I can do the same engine analysis for free at the Savvy web site but it is one more step. I used that very scenario to find a bad cylinder in an aircraft last year. And I usually export my G3X flight data to Google Earth for 3-D path depiction. This is a good conversation and all good stuff to know.
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Of course .... here's pics. Unfortunately taken in the hangar instead of in-flight.
There you have it.
Wow, Jlitd; I wish I had that information earlier. Garmin was not helpful nor forthcoming with integration information and I just went with what seemed like the best choices at the time. It was Aviat that discovered the GI-275 didn't integrate with the G3X and now we're waiting for Garmin to hopefully do so. And you expose that they have different buss architecture ...... oh-oh. Fingers crossed.
Outside of that, I like this set-up a lot. I know it can be a touchy subject but I'm a firm believer in "steam gages" which is why I kept them. I come from a sailplane and competition acro background and for me the human interface wants to be very quick and subtle - I rely more on outside inputs like feel, sound, sight etc.
I cannot answer the short / tall panel thing; I'm new to the Husky scene and don't know much. I hope the pics can tell you what you need. I can tell you that the panel is pretty full and there's not much room left (including behind) for more. In truth, I had wanted the GI-275 and AS to be the other way around but the depth of the GI-275 prevented that.
There you have it.
Wow, Jlitd; I wish I had that information earlier. Garmin was not helpful nor forthcoming with integration information and I just went with what seemed like the best choices at the time. It was Aviat that discovered the GI-275 didn't integrate with the G3X and now we're waiting for Garmin to hopefully do so. And you expose that they have different buss architecture ...... oh-oh. Fingers crossed.
Outside of that, I like this set-up a lot. I know it can be a touchy subject but I'm a firm believer in "steam gages" which is why I kept them. I come from a sailplane and competition acro background and for me the human interface wants to be very quick and subtle - I rely more on outside inputs like feel, sound, sight etc.
I cannot answer the short / tall panel thing; I'm new to the Husky scene and don't know much. I hope the pics can tell you what you need. I can tell you that the panel is pretty full and there's not much room left (including behind) for more. In truth, I had wanted the GI-275 and AS to be the other way around but the depth of the GI-275 prevented that.
Snowbirdxx
Well-Known Member
On my return flight from France, there was a taildragger meeting, I expierienced severe turbulence in rotors of windshear. The last thing I wanted there was a touchscreen. But for normal flying this panel looks very cool.
Hi Thomas! Agreed. However, we had turbulence on our flight home from Aviat (over "craters of the moon" in Idaho) and it wasn't too much of an issue. You can access everything in the G3X multiple ways (buttons and knob and touchscreen). That and a) I don't know 10% of the G3X capability; so b) I'm not using most of what it has to offer; and c) I tend not to switch screens etc much anyway. I would think that if you were depending on the touch interface for real IFR flight I wouldn't like it at all (but then I don't like IFR anyway).
jliltd
Active Member
Clifford,
Thanks for the photo.
You have the "short" panel which I prefer as it gives a bit more visibility for shorter folks like me.
More importantly, WOW that just might be my favorite Husky panel yet. I really really dig it. It seems a perfect balance of rugged with refined technology thrown in without trying to turn it into a Boeing. Sometimes loaded panels start looking busy and forced. This is very pleasing and functional. I just might steal this idea (with a few changes based on what I already have). I think you really hit a home run here. Great job by both you and Aviat! They should offer this very panel as a advanced VFR tech panel.
And one thing about the GI 275 over G5. They sure are pretty and respond fast.
Jim
jliltd
Active Member
One more thing. As I think about your panel being VFR with conventional airspeed and altimeter the ADHRS backup for G3X isn't nearly a big a deal as an all-glass G3X IFR system. You have everything you need with the steam gauges if G3X goes down. I have two 7" portrait G3X Touch displays here new in the box I was going to put in my Cessna 180 project but I have been transfixed on your panel photos a lot so I am thinking "what if".....
Hi jliltd ! I'm also using this Husky panel as a jumping off point for my Rocket project. My plan is to create a standard "six-pack" except the center column in this six-pack is the G3X. I've been toying with that idea for some time and had the opportunity to try something close in the Husky. I sure hope Garmin does the integration with the GI-275 and sooner would be great.
Another something I forgot to mention here earlier: I also bought my wife a Garmin Aera 760 for the back seat. She loves it. It bluetooths to both the GTX-345 and G3X so she has all the info I have and we can share/swap/modify/load flight plans back and forth. We're not fully versed in it yet but even with what we can do now we like it and she is totally excited with it. She can look ahead on the flight plan; know where and when we're planning to stop; look up local food and hotels; call and book a room and make dinner reservations; so when we land everything is taken care of. And yes, she's already been doing it. Pretty first class !! And yes, in case I haven't mentioned it, I love the heck out of her. I'm a very lucky man.
Another something I forgot to mention here earlier: I also bought my wife a Garmin Aera 760 for the back seat. She loves it. It bluetooths to both the GTX-345 and G3X so she has all the info I have and we can share/swap/modify/load flight plans back and forth. We're not fully versed in it yet but even with what we can do now we like it and she is totally excited with it. She can look ahead on the flight plan; know where and when we're planning to stop; look up local food and hotels; call and book a room and make dinner reservations; so when we land everything is taken care of. And yes, she's already been doing it. Pretty first class !! And yes, in case I haven't mentioned it, I love the heck out of her. I'm a very lucky man.
I should also clarify the name thing. I apologize for messing it up a bit. I read somewhere that it can be a good idea to be discrete about letting out personal information on the web etc. So ........
When we bought our Husky and before we had taken delivery of it; my wife named it Clifford (big red dog). By the way, she names almost everything. So when I signed up for this Husky site I used the name Clifford. Pretty simple and straight forward. But after taking delivery of the airplane, we changed its name to Rudy; it just seemed more fitting. And we are Larry and Robin.
I'm sure this is all too confusing so I won't be offended at all if when we meet I'm called Clifford. I'll just laugh.
Larry
When we bought our Husky and before we had taken delivery of it; my wife named it Clifford (big red dog). By the way, she names almost everything. So when I signed up for this Husky site I used the name Clifford. Pretty simple and straight forward. But after taking delivery of the airplane, we changed its name to Rudy; it just seemed more fitting. And we are Larry and Robin.
I'm sure this is all too confusing so I won't be offended at all if when we meet I'm called Clifford. I'll just laugh.
Larry
jliltd
Active Member
Here's an aera 660 I put in the back seat. Dana loves being able to navigate, check the weather and tune the SiriusXM music. I like it because it keeps her from getting bored and watching the back of my head for a couple of hours feeling like baggage.
Here's one I did in a Birddog. Aera 760 in the front, aera 660 in rear. You will also see a Trig VHF Com control head installed for the back seater (one radio, two control heads front and back). I like to buy my flush panel mounts for either of the aera models from gpsdock1.com. Dana did a write up on this in one of the Barnstormers E-Flyers a while back:
Jim
Here's one I did in a Birddog. Aera 760 in the front, aera 660 in rear. You will also see a Trig VHF Com control head installed for the back seater (one radio, two control heads front and back). I like to buy my flush panel mounts for either of the aera models from gpsdock1.com. Dana did a write up on this in one of the Barnstormers E-Flyers a while back:
Jim
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Good stuff Jim! Thanks for sharing. I didn't know there was an option for a dock other than Airgizmos.
For now Robin has her 760 on a knee pad and says she likes it. I've already put a USB charging port in the backseat so she runs the 760 (and her iPhone or Surface) off that. I personally don't like anything attached to my body so I'm conjuring up ways to mount the 760; but if she's happy with it on her knee so be it.
For now Robin has her 760 on a knee pad and says she likes it. I've already put a USB charging port in the backseat so she runs the 760 (and her iPhone or Surface) off that. I personally don't like anything attached to my body so I'm conjuring up ways to mount the 760; but if she's happy with it on her knee so be it.